Padded Double Stitch

A number of tatters use this formation when tatting in order to pad the double stitches they make in special sections of a design.

Tatters may be interested to learn that this formation was developed by Rhoda L. Auld in 1974. Her experimentations are recorded on page 84 of her book, 'Tatting: the contemporary art of knotting with a shuttle'. (A very good reference book) Rhoda Auld named a ring of these special double stitches, a '**self-padded ring**', describing a full ring of them as 'a solid, chunky ring'. Naturally, these padded stitches could also be applied to a chain.

Jane Eborall has fittingly referred to the formation as a '**double double stitch**' because it has four legs, rather than two.

In 2008 Ruth Perry named the same formation, a 'balanced double stitch'.

So tatters may choose among three names:
* the self-padded stitch/ring/chain - by how it appears
* the double double stitch - also by how it appears
* the balanced double stitch - by what it seems to do.
They all describe the same formation in tatted lace. You'll be right with whatever name you choose.

Hello Judith

Thank you once again for the history of this, I'm subscribing to calling it self-padded stitch, for the only reason that it makes the double stitch really bulky.. I would not have even understood what it means until Judy recommended it for a perfect 90 degrees bent in the chain, although I was not successful achieving it.

Muskaan.. where are you.?. this is your piece of information..

Best regards
Usha

Thank you So Very Much, Judith

It is indeed nice & in the correctness of things, to learn the origins of tatting techniques, terms, etc. and give due credit as well.
Like Usha (*thanks for this "yell" ;-)),*I came to know about it from the same thread ( Link ) & learned the technique.
I like it Immensely & have used it in all my 3 "designs" :
Link -- an elementary flower with few BDS at the tips of each petal
Link -- the stalk of cattail / pond reed, as well as in the leaf where I wanted some thickness

Link – "I love tatting" doodle, to keep the thickness even throughout.

Yes, it is definitely my favourite stitch so far.
It provides thickness, texture, interest, stiffness, bulk, highlight. It is very easy to do & very practical for long lengths of chains (I haven't tried it in rings yet).

Perhaps I will continue to call it Balanced Double Stitch - that is the 1st term I learned from Judy, and learned the technique from Ruth Perry. I like the sound of it, too. It wouldn't be wrong to call it a 'Square stitch'
Additionally, now that you have endorsed the historical correctness, I can do so without any discredit to either Rhoda L. Auld or to Jane Eborall. From now on, however, there will be no mistake in Recognising or confusing each of the 3 terms.

Thanks again, dear Judith, for this post & hope you continue to illuminate (and correct) us ... We remain students in the tatting world...

You're welcome, Usha and Muskaan.

It was meant to illuminate, as so many different terms exist, thanks (or not) to the internet.

Rhoda Auld wrote that the 'stitch' could be self-padded with either half-stitch as well, depending on (1) where the s-p ring (or s-p chain) was positioned in the design and (2) how much padding was required. She provided an illustration on page 85 of her book.

The 'balanced ds' is another example of duplicating terminology: just like 'shoelace trick', 'Dutch needle tatting', 'self-closing mock ring', 'alligator join', 'clunies'. If we all are aware of the original terms/names, we will be more informed and there won't be so much confusion when writing patterns.

Judith , Muskaan

Good Morning

I would still reserve my comments about the stitch bringing the effect that it is supposed to, as described by RuthPerry. I haven't been able to achieve the stiffness on the large rings or very long chains with this stitch.
The thread gets really curly for so many flip-pass turns. This is my experience.

So I think a notes on how it should be made to avoid too many twists in the thread would be helpful to me.

Best Regards
Usha

Morning Judith & Usha :-)
Now I need to check up the duplicates floating around for all these other terms ! ;-)) Another is the Catherine Wheel Join, I think ?
It will definitely help while writing &/or understanding patterns from any decade - past to present ! And a designer or pattern-writer can, if required, mention the alternate terms as an addendum even if s/he follows one particular nomenclature.

I have another that confuses me no end : is it a Josephine Knot or a Josephine Ring ? Is there a difference or are they mutually interchangeable ?

Usha, I haven't faced the thread twisting problem with BDS any more than is normal. But, yes, the 'stiffness' is relative & limited. Thread size & type probably contributes to the overall effect as well (as I noticed with Red Heart thread v/s Anchor Mercerized Cotton). Ruth Perry demonstrated with really thick thread - might even be a cord, if I remember correctly.

Muskaan,
A Josephine knot is made with about 5 or 6 first half stitches of the double stitch. Although it starts the same as a ring because there are only a few stitches when completed it looks like a knobby little knot. The Josephine ring is made with the first half of the double stitch but so many stitches are done that it is actually looks and is a ring when completed.

Hope this helps.

Thank you, ladies, for posting about this valuable stitch. I read about this technique but didn't apply it, and now the knowledge is all gone!

Would you guys mind adding some links to this thread for tutorials, videos, etc. I love that we are creating a record/repository for posterity!

And - is this stitch used to create a zig-zag in a chain or to take some bulk out of the caps to make the chain straighter?

Sarahwood8, The balanced double stitch is designed to make the four loops encircling the core thread almost exactly the same width on the front as on the back. A normal DS is compressable --squishable -- on the back more than on the front. So, when you tension a ring or chain it squishes on one side and the ring or chain takes on its classic arc. Its done by making an extra circling motion on both the front and back half of a stitch. I think AKTATTER has photos on her website. Its current uses are primarily to take the curve OUT of a chain or ring for a specified number of stitches.. like a square cake pan has straight sides and rounded corners... It does get a bit "thicker" than normal DS and you can see them if you know what you're looking for, but they are not very noticeable. Judith's description of them as "padded" confuses me. I have only seen "padded" used in connection with doubling the CORE thread. Those stitches also look some larger. They are most often used to fill the center; if you are needle tatting with a core thread that doesn't match the needle size very well, you can compensate by doubling the core.

Early JKs were also made by twisting the shuttle thread around itself several times (like roll tatting) before closing the 'ring'. This resulted in a clump or knot on the thread. [This could be a 'missing link' between knotting and tatting? Hence the 'knot' part of JK.] Because of fewer half-stitches, JKs were sometimes closed halfway to form a shell-like effect. You may find early photographs with these shells attached to the edge of hems.

The JR can have 8-12 half-stitches so that it forms a disk-like ring when closed. [I love them!] They were also added along bare threads to decorate between rings, because traditional tatters avoided too much bare thread in designs.

Some tatters also use JP = Josephine picot, because the decorative tiny rings were substituted for picots on the outer edges of chains.

In the C21 we are more informed about these subtle differences, so you can choose whichever name you choose for the situation. We'll know what you mean.

'Self-padded' was Rhoda Auld's original description for adding an extra one or two 'legs' to the double stitch, just as the balanced double stitch does. The double stitch is padded, not the core. So a self-padded double stitch could have three or four 'legs' depending on whether you add an extra twist to one or both half-stitches. Thus you can produce a self-padded double stitch which will create a self-padded ring or a self-padded chain. Of course, this all applies in shuttle tatting, so it may present a challenge for needle tatters.

'Padded' is also applied to pearl tatting when we use multiple threads (or a cord), as the core thread in this instance. 'Padded' is a concept which can be applied in a number of ways.

We're learning new things every day. :-)

Hi,
jane eborall has explained it with diagrams. ' Intatters' thread is so inspiring .

Sparky & Judith,
thank you so much for clarifying about JKs & JRs. Due to my confusion, I generally used Both terms in my queries/posts ! Not any more :-))


Sarah,
here is a link to Ruth Perry's BDS. I followed this to learn how to do the stitch & has become one of my favorites for freeform tatting ! http://www.georgiaseitz.com/2008/ruthplongringchains.pdf . It is easy to do with shuttle tatting, but I'm not sure about needle tatting. If you have any trouble, shoot me a line & I'll try to clarify ...

Judy,
IMHO, the 'padded' probably refers to how each half stitch encloses another half stitch, the latter providing a 'padding'. But I can see how confusing this can be !!! I guess its what one learns first - I learned the BDS first & still haven't tried using doubled core thread. ... Posts such as these are meant to dispel some of this confusion, hopefully not adding to it, LOL ;-))) Language & terminology changes over time & I prefer calling it BDS or DDS rather than the original self-padded ring.

Oops, my apologies. I did not see Judith has already explained this ....

Good Morning to you all

BDS.. looks like time to tat a sample and check and post the observations here.
Judith, Judy, I use shuttle to tat.. so If I'm not wrong the shuttle thread is passed through the leg of the stitch after it is flipped. Am I doing it correctly?
Passing the shuttle thread thru the leg (the little loop that forms on the core and not the cap) 2 times, one for the first half and then for the second half,, both the times after the flip.

Best Regards
Usha

Thanks for the link, Muskann! That was the article I read so long ago and couldn't remember where : ) You've got me pointed in the right direction. Now to get out my shuttles and needles...

So - If I understand all of your wonderful tatters right, the BDS is used for long rings and chains so they will have less curve in them. But the BDS is not used to create a zig-zag chain - right?

If so, can anyone point me to directions for making a zig zag chain? You guys are the best! : )

Hello Sarah - don't know if this link will work but Tat-Man has a video with instructions on making a zig-zag chain. -- Maggie V

http://www.tat-man.net/tatterville/howtotat/howtotat.html

Hi Usha :-)

Even though this query is not addressed to me, I will butt in like a spoiled brat, if only so that experts can confirm or reject how I learned to do the BDS.

The 2nd (padded) st is done in the Exact Same Way as the 1st one, also on the core thread.
eg. If you are doing the 1st half st, then flip it, and Within this flipped st, make the 2nd FHS; flip this too; then snug up both stitches. Both are done on the Core thread, Not on the leg or loop of leg.
Similarly, for SHS, make one & flip; then move your shuttle exactly as you did previously for the SHS & make another (also on the core thread), flip & then snug both into position.
I checked out Jane Eborall's tutorial & that is what she seems to be saying too : http://www.janeeborall.freeservers.com/doubledouble.pdf

Hope this helps.

Hi Sarah,
Glad to have been of help :-)
I was in a rush this morning, hence did not complete my answer.

1. Besides Ruth's link, as given, here is Jane Eborall's tutorial with graphics, on Padded Double Stitch (title) or Double Double Stitch (pdf file download title) : http://www.janeeborall.freeservers.com/doubledouble.pdf

2. If we come across "dds". it does Not stand for Double Double Stitch, as I just found out. Instead, it is daisy double stitch which she uses in Daisy Picot tutorial : http://www.janeeborall.freeservers.com/daisypicotriet.pdf

3. For Zig-zag (or 'Z') chains :
   http://www.paradisetreasures.com/schainvszchain.html -- this page also has a comparative account & instructions for 'S' chain, convex & concave chains, etc.. Superb resource !!!
   http://www.tat-man.net/tatterville/howtotat/zigzagtat.html -- this is tatman's page with instructions for zig-zag chain. So even if the video link provided by CACatTatter does not work, you will still have this to fall back on.

Hope these help :-)

Here is the link to Ruth Perry/Rosella Linden's video on how to make the Balanced Double Stitch, BDS. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3c99nb0CIg

I had some difficulty getting the double double stitch right - I was putting the shuttle through the wrong place on its 'second time round'. But it's worth getting right. There's a picture in my album '25 motif challenge' of a bracelet I made using the stitch. It works well for a bracelet because the chain is not curved as a normal chain would be.

As you will have noticed from all the above, we tatters get ourselves into problems by duplicating existing terminology. This gives us cause to keep ourselves informed. [I don't know how new C21 tatters feel about the situation??] This is one reason I published 'An Illustrated Dictionary of Tatting'. It contains a good range of terminology with historical notes. For those interested, it is available from Lacis.com.

In the course of this thread, we have a good example of how subtle changes occur when tatters don't take particular notice of what is written. Rhoda Auld's original term 'self-padded' has already been changed to 'padded', .... and this is how the confusion starts.

The self-padded stitch, s-p ds, (aka balanced double stitch): Add an extra twist around the auxiliary thread with the shuttle BEFORE transferring the half-stitch.

For tatters who are members of the IOLI, there is an article by Sabina Carden-Madden in the Summer Bulleting 2009 which discusses the s-p ds and the bds. It overlooks the fact that Rhoda L. Auld arrived at her 'invention' by sheer experimentation in 1974, not by the application of a known element from knotting.

Funnily enough, this is also illustrated in Rhoda L. Auld's book. It is also in Elgiva Nicholls' book: 'Tatting: technique & history'. You need two shuttles. Tat 6 ds (for example), tension in a line, swap shuttles, tat a further 6 ds, tension, swap shuttles and continue. Some tatters insert lock stitches to seal the tensions of the threads, but the swapping of shuttles has the same effect.

Yikes,, I need to get out Rhoda's book, and the other two as well. Ok, Judith, i understand the self-padded concept. Musakaan, how about some experiments on the effects of three twists before transfer.. What does that do to curvature? is it so over-self padded that it turns it inside out? Needle tatting self padded? Very easy, just circle that finger twice before putting on the needle. Wonder if the order matters on the needle...twist 1,2, or 2,1?

Hi Judy :-)

That is a Wonderful idea ! My own guess is that the alternating sequence (1,2 / 2,1) might give it just a very slight uneven or wavy edge as compared to an even doubling. I will definitely try this & the tripled ds out & post pictures.
Very interesting .

"An Illustrated Dictionary of Tatting'. It contains a good range of terminology with historical notes."

I have this this book and would highly recommend it for any serious tatter. It is one of my all time "go to" books.
I got it before I was on line, even with all the info on line I still go there first. It is usually closer than my computer when I am tatting. Glad it is still in print, and written by one of our members, thanks Judith for once again sharing your knowledge and expertise.